I heard AMD's prices are dropping due to the release of Intel's new dual core cpus..
so, is this the right time to get a new rig? or will the prices continue to drop in a few months time?

currently my specs are:
p4 2.4
asus p4vp-mx motherboard
radeon 9200se 128mb
256mb ddram
40gb seagate barracuda hdd

Should i just add some ram and a new hdd or change the whole rig?

i mainly use my com for graphic designing..photoshop and illustrator, and some gaming.

and is the upcoming pc fair a good place to buy the parts?

-edit- Ok, ive decided to get a new rig...but the big question is:
Intel Core 2 Duo E6300 or AMD Athlon64 x2 3800?

Hello there,
Actually now is a good time to grab a decent dual-core AMD because AMD desktop CPU prices have dropped. According to AMD's latest pricings, the Athlon X2 3800+ (for socket AM2) is RM560 only.

Your old rig is pretty outdated and that 256MB RAM is definitely not enough for Photoshop or gaming. And your 9200SE is surely not good for gaming... you need a 7300GT DDR3 atleast.

So I suggest, you check out our system guide thread in this forum and plan on your new rig.

As for PC Fair, I really have little to say about it but don't expect crazy prices there. Some things are sold cheap but don't expect to build a rig from PC Fair. I'd say, visit LYP often and you'll be pretty satisfied with the prices there. PC Fair is only good if you are looking for a few specific hardware like LCD, HDD, RAM or VGA.

I have a good suggestion:
Intel Core 2 Duo E6300 (1.86Ghz, Dual Core, 2x 1MB L2, S775) - 730
MSI P965 Neo - 450
2x Kingston DDR2 533 Value RAM 512MB - 320
Galaxy 7600GT 256MB 1.4ns GDDR3 Overclockded (12PL) - 785
160.0GB Seagate Baracudda SATA2 NCQ 8MB - 225 (you suggest)
Lite-On DVD-RW Drive - 160
Antec True Power 2.0 430W (A-PFC) - 350 (recommended)

Total: 3020

Is should be really good for graphic designing, photoshop/illustrator, and some gaming, also video editing to!

I think PC-Fair(11-13 Aug 2006) had more good price, if you compare above.

And also the system guide thread.

How does the Intel Core 2 Duo compare with an AMD Athlon X2 3800+, in terms of value for money? is there a great difference in performance?

Click here to the comparison between Intel Dual Core and AMD Dual Core.

Actually... The AMD is cheaper:
AMD Athlon64 3800+ X2 (2.0Ghz, Dual Core, 2x 512KB L2, AM2) - 580
MSI K9N Neo (nForce 550) - 295
2x Kingston DDR2 533 Value RAM 512MB - 320
Galaxy 7600GT 256MB 1.4ns GDDR3 Overclockded (12PL) - 785
160.0GB Seagate Baracudda SATA2 NCQ 8MB - 225 (you suggest)
Lite-On DVD-RW Drive - 160
Antec True Power 2.0 430W (A-PFC) - 350 (recommended)

Total: 2715

according to the review, the Core 2 Duo definately outperforms the Athlon 64 x2...

but im still wondering whether to spend an extra rm300 on the Core 2 or take advantage of AMD's price cut.. and since the Core 2 Duo is relatively new, is it advisable to get it so soon after its release?

Yup... Core 2 Duo is more powerful than X2 but do you need all that power?
Besides, a decent Core 2 Duo motherboard is quite expensive and most C2D compatible motherboards are not matured yet. As for SLI/CrossFire support, only high-end motherboards have dual PCI-E slots.

On the other hand, the X2 setup will save you a lot and you can spend the cash on a better VGA or add more RAM. X2 motherboards are quite matured and you can even purchase the DFI Infinity NF UltraII-M2 for RM435 which runs SLI with modded ForceWare drivers. The good thing is, these X2 processors can easily hit 3GHz with minimum FSB overclocking air cooling.

Overclock the 3800+ x2 to 3Ghz = buy better HSF and better mobo(add more $$$), and not really stable to... How about OC the Core 2 Duo? I think PCMM not only OC the AMD right?

P/S: I also find a good place for review the AM2 3800+ x2 by click here.

Haiz..really a hard choice to make...

but what PCMM said is true..if i get a Core 2, must also spend more on a decent mobo. and i will rather overclock the tried and tested 64 x2 then a new Core 2 Duo..im not a pro in overclocking but can a overclocked 64 x2 match or even outperform the more powerful stock Core 2 Duo?

Anyway, for the moment, i think i will get the 64 x2...at least until someone convinces me to choose the Core 2 Duo instead.. or i manage to get my hands on some extra $$

Can anyone suggest a mobo and PSU for my rig?
the budget for the mobo will be around rm400.. hopefully less than that.
and the PSU around 250.

The lower class PSU is Enermax 320Watt NoiseTaker Blue Power (Non PFC) - 170, but this PSU life shorter compare with Antec True Power 2.0 430W, also try lower the VGA card (exp: 7300GT 128MB GDDR3 - 400).

Actually you don't need a very expensive mobo to overclock X2. The Infinity NF UltraII-M2 for example costs on RM435 and easily goes beyond 300HTT. As for the HSF, doesn't the X2 comes with a 4 heatpipe stock cooler? From my experience, the stock cooler's performance is as good as Thermalright XP-90.
C2D will be fun to overclock but as I said earlier, you need to get a decent board. Besides, the E6300 comes with a very low multiplier and you need a very good board to push higher. Unless you can afford a E6600 lah... then it's a different story.


Well, the main reason I suggest X2 is because of budget. If you got extra cash to spend, why not go for the C2D?
FYI, clock-per-clock, the C2D is better than X2 in almost any benchmarks. If you look at Super PI results, even a 1.8GHz C2D will perform better than a 2.8GHz or 3GHz X2.

What's the difference between a DFI Infinity NF UltraII-M2 and a DFI Infinity NF-M2?

and can you please suggest a decent mobo for the C2D and its price

as for my budget...its quite flexible.. can go up to rm3000+ but of course, i'll want to keep it as low as possible

NF UltraII-M2 has dual PCI-E graphics slots whereas the NF-M2 has only a sinlge PCI-E graphics slot. Apart from that, the UltraII-M2 uses nForce 4 Ultra chipset vs plain nForce 4 chipset on the NF-M2.

As for decent C2D boards, you can try the Gigabyte GA-965P-DS3 (RM560) or the Asus P5B Deluxe (RM750) or DFI Infinity 975X/G (RM900) or Asus P5W DH Deluxe (RM900+). Either way, expect to spend above RM500 for a decent C2D board. OR you can go with the basic Intel C2D board (Intel BOXDP965LTCK) which costs about RM370, provided you don't plan to OC at all.

Is really hard to chose a good mobo these day... Unless don't have any budget problem.

If i dont overclock much and i definately wont be able to afford SLi right now (maybe in the future ), do you recommed a MSI P965 Neo or is it better to get a Gigabyte GA-965P-DS3? other suggestions are welcome...but i dont think i'll be able to spend more than 560 on a mobo

In all the tests between the C2D and the 64x2, the C2D wins in almost all benchmarks...i dont really know how to interprete the results..but is there a great difference in the benchmark tests? i certainly wouldnt want to spend an extra rm400 just for gaining a few extra seconds or some extra fps. actually i dont mind spending the extra money if the C2D system is well worth it...

And between the C2D and the 64x2(AM2), which one is more future-proof?

To mod: please help me change the topic to -
title: Getting a new rig
sub title: Conroe or 64x2?
thanks...

What I think is:
AMD X2 processor(AM2):
1. Cheaper then Intel C2D.
2. For overclockers or not.
3. Slower then Intel C2D, after OC still slower then OCed Intel C2D.

AMD low-end mobo(AM2):
1. Budget.
2. For not overclockers.
3. Still cheaper then Intel low-end C2D support mobo.

AMD high-end mobo(AM2):
1. Money is not your problem.
2. For overclockers.

Intel C2D processor:
1. Litter bit expensive then AMD X2(AM2).
2. For overclockers or not.
3. Faster then AMD X2(AM2), after OC still faster then OCed AMD X2(AM2).

Intel low-end C2D support mobo:
1. Budget.
2. For not overclockers.
3. Still more expensive then AMD low-end mobo(AM2).

Intel high-end C2D support mobo:
1. Money is not your problem.
2. For overclockers.

Simple right?

Since the MSI P965 Neo does not support SLI/CrossFire, why not get the Intel BOXDP965LTCK (about RM370) or go cheap with ASRock 775Dual-VSTA (RM200+) instead? Anyhow, the MSI P965 Neo is still a decent board, provided if it does not cost over RM500.

As for future-proof, it's always better to get a board that supports SLI/CrossFire... but most budget C2D boards don't even have dual PCI-E VGA slots. I might be wrong here, but since there have been some info saying that socket AM2 motherboards will support the upcoming AM3 processor, I'd say getting an AM2 setup will be future-proof. Besides, you can easily grab a AM2 board with dual PCI-E slot for less than RM500. Anyhow, the

But, the current king of performance is C2D for sure. The only thing to ponder is the motherboard... is it worth to go for a budget board or will you regret not getting a better board to overclock your C2D? In my opinion, I will not buy a C2D if I were to run it at stock! I don't mind spending that RM150 extra to get a better board and clock it up to 3GHz to match the more expensive X6800 EE.

Edit: You can edit your first post in this thread to change the topic title.

Good news! Hard Ware Zone just awarded the Intel C2D E6300 <Most Value For Money Award>, by watch this Intel Core 2 Duo E6300 - Small Budget, Big Overclocker, hope it change your mind.

yes, now is a good time to get a rig (especially if you're a gamer), as the conroes are now available. Remember that in September, nvidia may launch their DX10 cards, the G80 series. Couple a high-end G80 card with the conroe and 2GB of RAM, and you've got yourself a rig that's way more powerful than a rig (conroe and 2GB) that has a 7950GX2 instead

But price wise, especially on jacked up Conroe prices, it may not be a good time to grab a Conroe now.
I might get my own Conroe next year only... Most of the retailers are selling them way over the MSRP.

you can always settle for the AMD processors or the original Intel Dual cores... they should be cheaper now

Yes... which is why I think the X2 3800+ is sweet. For about RM580, the X2 3800+ offers much better performance than the Pentium 930 priced at RM650 (unless price drops). Currently, the cheapest Conroe is at RM710. So IF you have another RM150 to spend, you can get a Conroe already...provided if you can spend RM550 for the Gigabyte DS3 Conroe board.

X2 3800 + UltraII-M2 (Dual PCI-E) = RM1015
E6300 + DS3 (Single PCI-E) = RM1260
Conroe - X2 = RM245

If you want RAW CPU power, dig another RM245 and go for the Conroe. If you're an avid gamer, grab the X2 and save cash for another graphics card!

The older 8xx or 9xx series are still being sold at above RM600, except for the 805 which goes for RM450. Although you don't need a great board for the 805 (due to the higher multiplier), the 805 pumps a lot of heat when overclocked. So you end up spending more on the cooling... Nevertheless, a 3GHz Pentium 805/930 is still no match for a 3GHz X2

How long should i wait?(prepared to wait about 1-2 months if necessary) will the price fall soon? Anyway, is rm730 the MSRP for the C2D e6300?

Maybe until the end of this year as the supply kicks up.
I checked LYP prices and the E6300 goes for RM710 but not sure if was a budle price or sold separately price.

Today I just went back from PC-Fair(11-13 Aug 2006) , lots of C2D promotion, but the promotion is more expensive then Low Yat Plaza...

Intel C2D E6300:
PC-Fair: RM 750-800(promotion )
LYP: RM710-780

And many C2D mainboard display is using Gigabyte GA-965P-DQ6! Also expensive then LYP...

Gigabyte GA-965P-DQ6:
PC-Fair: RM 980-1000+(promotion )
LYP: RM 940-980

And any one saw the hidden X1950(XT?/GT?) at Corsair booth? That guy can't tell me what model but he say is using GDDR4... He also say the brand name will change to AMD...

E6300 selling above RM750 at promotion price?
C'mon man! That's "con ppl price" already...
If Intel really want to succeed, they have to warn those retailers who jack up the price like nobodies business.

For me, PC Fair is just a marketing tool. These days I rarely see a good deal at PC Fair.

Corsair's booth got X1950? Sounds interesting... Were they just displaying it or was running?

Btw, it will be nice if someone could post some pictures. =)
I miss taking pictures at PC Fair...

Edit: Gigabyte DQ6 also got jacked up? Which booth did that? Did you check out ScanArt's booth? They should have some Gigabyte stuff too...

Corsair's booth has a X1950?! The thing isn't even out yet! You sure?
Note: The X1950s have been confirmed to use GDDR4 ram, didn't you check the topic i posted about it?

And what do you expect from malaysian stores? They just love to jack up the price, mainly coz the majority of ppl don't really know much about PCs.

I don't really see any great deals in PC-fair, even though loads of people brag about getting great deals. Sad to see people get ripped off.

On a sidenote, i've ordered myself a Galaxy 7300GT DDR3 128MB (since the 256MB was nowhere in sight). Should last me a while till ATI releases their DX10 cards next year. I'm hoping to overclock the thing to at least 600/1600.

I second that...
Anyways, local retail stores are selling E6300 and other hw way cheaper than at PC Fair. Those PC Fair exhibitors were probably jacking up prices to cover their booth cost for PC Fair. I heard renting a booth at PWTC was much cheaper than at KLCC. Increase the booth price, and you will get an eXpensive PC Fair.

Running, I also forgot, that guys also say can't take photo to, but if you look closer, the 6-pin power plug is middle end of the card, and sli 'gold finger' to!

But I show you any way(sorry, no photo! )

sli 'gold finger'
----------v----------
___
##|_==_==____________________________
##|@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@|
##|@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@| <-------- 6-pin plug not here
##|@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@|_
##|@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@| <----- 6-pin plug
##|@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@|
##|@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@|
##|@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@|
##|-------|_____________________|-------------
##|

Gigabyte DQ6 is almost showing every where, like Corsair booth, Leadtek booth, etc...


I think by the time they call AMD DX10...

screw AMD and their dumb name-changing tactics... now the cards are gonna sound bad. Just imagine ATI r600 changing to AMD r600.... ugh

Anything else that was interesting at the PC fair? Didn't bother to go coz i've already got all that i need (especially a new 7300GT DDr3).

Hmm... I think just the hidden X1950 is interesting only...

How much was the price of the X1950? In the market already ar?

Not release yet, but they say coming soon!

At LYP just release the AMD 3600+ x2 AM2 price, only RM 465(13/8/2006), compare to x3800+ x2 AM2, RM 570(13/8/2006).

Spec:
AMD 3600+ X2
Dual Core
2.0Ghz
2x 256KB L2
AM2

AMD 3800+ X2
Dual Core
2.0Ghz
2x 512KB L2
AM2

RM465 for the X2 3600+ is not bad... Let's see if someone can get one and overclock it to 3GHz!

On the other hand, I wouldn't midn paying another RM100 extra for more cache...

Just had the review, the 3600+ X2 can OC to 2.6GHz with stock voltage and HSF, click here to the review.


wow...

Arghh... I'm forced to wait till Sept to get my hands on the X2 3600+

Now
~~~
if we buy AM2, we use the slower A64x2
if we buy LGA775, we can use the awesome Core2


Future
~~~~~
if we buy AM2 now, we can drop in a K8L later (native Quadcore, shared L2 cache & 68W TDP)

if we buy LGA775 now, we can drop in a Kentsfield later (2x die Quadcore, 2 pieces of L2 & 110W TDP)


Maybe this can help u decide which platform to buy

Wow..does this mean that i dont need to change the mobo if i upgrade to the new quadcores?
When will these quadcores be released? and is it true that the K8L with the native quadcore will be better?

Actually... I do think X2 3600 is enough for the future(5 years for Malaysian)... cause most game(could be all) is all happend from display card right? And quadcore? Unless you always run '4' program at the same time la!

5 years? too long la...5 years ago i think i was using a amd k6 or something...
but i dont think i would need a quadcore at least for a few years... dual core will be enough for me...

anyway, is there a big difference between a X2 3600 and X2 3800? is it only the L2 cache that separates this 2 processors?

Yes... only the L2 cache. X2 38 comes with 512MB whereas the X2 36 comes with 256MB only. IMO, the X2 36 was supposed to be Sempr0n X2 cause only Sempr0ns have 256MB cache.
If you got extra RM100 to spend, I'd strongly suggest getting the X2 38 instead.

To StRiKeR07:

If you really go for AMD dual core, remember to check this thread of new AMD drivers first, cause this new AMD drivers seem to improve the AMD dual core , but donno is real or not!

Before:


After:

Ok, i've decided to go for C2D

My list of specs:
proc: Intel Core 2 Duo E6300
mobo: Gigabyte GA-965P-DS3
ram: 512mb Kingston Value Ram DDR2 667 (x2)
gc: *undecided about the brand* 7600GT DDR3 256mb
hdd: 160GB Seagate Baracuda SATA2
psu: Enermax FMA 460w
monitor: 17"CRT / 17" LCD
casing: Coolermaster Centurion 5

any comments about the specs? Please help me choose a gc...was considering a Galaxy 7600ge or MSI 7600gt (from LYN bulk sales) which one is better?

I'll be going to Singapore later to source for the parts...will it be cheaper in S'pore or JB? can't go to Lowyat coz its too far

Hmm... You forgot sound card and speakers? What Galaxy 7600GE memory you want? 128MB or 256MB? The G 7600GE 128MB is about RM 480 at LYP, and normal 7600GT 256MB about RM 680, I also remember there two kind of MSI 7600 GT, one is stock HSF and the other one is bigger HSF.

If you plan to get a gc, I suggest you wait a bit coz NVIDIA will be releasing the 7900GS for RM730+ only.
IIRC, PC parts in Sing is a bit expensive than in Msia.

gah, the 7900GS is priced around RM899. How much is the 7600GT in malaysia right now? Coz the last time i checked, it was around RM799.

I won't be upgrading anyway. The 7900GS is only faster than the 7600GT by a bit, about 1.5x faster. Looks like i really saved a lot of cash and bought a card that is nearly as good as the 7600GT when overclocked

Just came back from Singapore, and the prices there are more expensive
to be exact, rm400 more for the whole system (excluding the casing and monitor)

Will be using my current speakers...as for the sound card, onboard is good enough for me Anyway, i can get a Galaxy 7600ge DDR3 256mb for rm525 and a MSI 7600gt (stock HSF) for about rm545. Is the clock speed the only difference between the 7600GE and GT? are they using different chipsets?

How long do i need to wait? and will the price of the 7600GT drop when the 7900GS is released?

I don't think the 7600GT is so expensive...should be less than rm700
Do you mean 1.5 times faster than the 7600GT?...if so, i'll surely get a 7900GS
What card did you buy?

i got a Galaxy 7300GT DDR3 card and overclocked it. Now i'm set for gaming

I haven't seen a 7900GS review yet, but judging by the specs, the performance is definitely in between the 7600GT and the 7900GT, hence i said it's probably 1.5x faster

Yup.. the 7900GS should sit between the 76GT and 79GT... at stock of cause.
However, the 79GS is based on the 79GT (G71) core, which as 24 pipes. If you didn't know, the high-end 79GTX also uses the same G71 core.
This should give you guys some idea on what overclocks to expect on the 79GS, based on the 79GT and 79GTX.
The only thing that seperates the 79GS, GT and GTX is clearly the clock speeds. I'm sure with a little overclocking action, the 79GS should perform "as good as" the higher end models. Drop some pencil shading action on it, the 79GS might just be the dream child we've been waiting for.

If NVIDIA made you go crazy over their 73GT DDR3, I'm sure the 79GS will do the same too. I guess it's time to sell out your 73GTs and prepare for some 79GS.

We will be having the 79GS from Inno3D soon. So till then, I'll be keeping my mouth shut!